Neue Nockenwelle für TR 4 A

[skorpion]

nein, sicher nicht. So lange das möglicherweise eine Einstellung der LL-Düsen oder Zündung ist.
Leider weiß ich immer noch nicht wer denn im Raum Karlsruhe mir diese Einstellungen vernünftig machen kann.

Gruß
Hubert

[head_guy6]

"gibt neue mit 270° bei Kent, die TR4-4 High Torque

Neu??!!

What a load of bollox!!

https://www.burtonpower.com/parts-by-br ... c224k.html

This camshaft is a FORD KENT 1600 224 camshaft profile 20+ years old.

"Power band 1000-6500rpm .420" valve lift, 270deg duration, timing 32/58/67/23, inlet timing at full lift 103deg, inlet lift at TDC 0.095", clearances .016"in/.018"ex."

Just more of the same shit.
Exhaust timing is advanced 9 degrees over inlet because the KENT engine has such poor exhaust valve flow.

[head_guy6]

nein, sicher nicht. So lange das möglicherweise eine Einstellung der LL-Düsen oder Zündung ist.

Leider weiß ich immer noch nicht wer denn im Raum Karlsruhe mir diese Einstellungen vernünftig machen kann.

Gruß
Hubert

Nachstes mal dass ich in KA bin, mach ich dieser Weber Einstellung so dass richtig lauft.

OK?

[gelpont19]

Tja Hubert - dann zieh dich mal warm an...

win

[mats]

Hubert,schau mal in dein Postfach.

[MadMarx]

What a load of bollox!!

I love the English for their expressive language.

[V8]

Nachstes mal dass ich in KA bin, mach ich dieser Weber Einstellung so dass richtig lauft.
OK?

Um Gottes Willen!
Bei "sideways" gibt es einen Bericht, wo er die sensiblen Vergaser am
Straßenrand "tunt" und auf den Hinweis, dass bei mir Equipment im
vierstelligen Bereich dazu erforderlich war hat er geschrieben, dass er
bei jemandem die dazu erforderlichen Düsen tauschen durfte.

Wie das im Süden der Republik klappen soll, ist mir schleierhaft.
Ganz wichtig: Das ist kein Problem der Einstellung, sondern Teile
müssen gewechselt werden. Teure Teile! CO Tester ist Pflicht!

So als Tipp: Hab kürzlich einen 3er abgestimmt, dafür waren die Daten
aus dem Internet völlig daneben. LL 45F9 war noch okay, aber speziell
der Tipo 152 hatte unpassende Übergangsbohrungen. Das läuft nur
zufriedenstellend, wenn die erste Bohrung geändert wird. Sonst muss
die LLD zu groß gewählt werden, damit es nicht mehr pätscht.

Die Hauptdüsen waren alle nach den Angaben viel zu groß bemessen,
wie auch die LKD. Lambda lag untenrum damit beharrlich unter 0,7!

Schau nach 45F9 LL und HD um die 110-120.
Als Mischrohr hab ich F16 gewählt weil evtl. wie bei Dir der Motor
untenrum überfettete bei Vollgas.
Wenn das nicht in etwa so vorgefunden wird, such Dir jemand mit Plan!
Teile auf Verdacht kaufen und testen wird zu teuer!

[head_guy6]

45F9 war noch okay, aber speziell
der Tipo 152 hatte unpassende Übergangsbohrungen.

Das läuft nur
zufriedenstellend, wenn die erste Bohrung geändert wird. Sonst muss
die LLD zu groß gewählt werden, damit es nicht mehr pätscht.

Schau nach 45F9 LL und HD um die 110-120.

Als Mischrohr hab ich F16 gewählt weil evtl.

Oh grief!
F16 is STANDARD emulsion factory pre-fitted, this is usually not right.

These Spanish 151 Weber are crap.

You don't say anything about the carbs you are using, chokes, emulsions, float height, SIZE!! 40DCOE or 45DCOE??, fuel pumps, advance curves, CR,exhaust manifold, etc etc etc....inlet manifolds, (how shit they may be like Bastuck ones!), valve clearances (VERY IMPORTANT on DCOE!).

Nothing.
And you want someone to comment on why the engine stumbles & claim a 290degree camshaft won't work on the road??

SU carbs.....(which are crap carbs anyway).

GET SERIOUS. mark all this before you write anything anywhere!

Alles hier ist nur Blodsinn!!

:boese:

[head_guy6]

DCOE STUFF:-

NOTE:- emulsions do all sorts of things to the progression for the simple reason the INTERNAL wells dimension vary.

Idle jets 45f8, 45f9, 50f8, 55.....
Do you have any idea how to select the right one??

Then there are the different sizes and types of DCOE inc the pump bleed back ratios....90%, 10% etc etc.....

So some "crazy" idea that a main size of 110, without knowing anything air corrector, choke size..NOTHING ...

U want a small choke on a small carb on a large engine....28mm, or a large carb with a small choke like 30mm????

....it's just all STUPID,-

just as is the idea you THROW a Newman camshaft or Kent camshaft in there and get a result!!

I got 20% more torque from a TR5 CP pi injection engine with WEBER 40DCOE carbs up to 3000rpm compared with the Pi.

WTF do you do to explain such a result?
This was a better result than any aftermarket non standard camshaft & one of the best cars I have ever driven in town.
The head and cam were STANDARD, as was the exhaust!!!!!

Then start looking at all this lot!!


You people in Germany will all finish by driving me nuts!
None of you appear to know anything about tuning an old engine, then you give all kinds of useless or hopeless advice!

[RobertB]

@head_guy6:

Back to original topic!!

Simple question:

What is your recommendation for Claudius? Which camshaft for his stock TR4 should he buy?

Simple answer, please.

Rgds Robert

[skorpion]

Hallo head_guy6,

I'm hope to see vou.
Please call me if you are in Karlsruhe ))

see you
Hubert

[head_guy6]

@head_guy6:
Simple question:

What is your recommendation for Claudius?
Which camshaft for his stock TR4 should he buy?

This is ON TOPIC, but a long answer.

A note about Holbay racing engines & my bit in the last days of it:-

https://forums.autosport.com/topic/1356 ... nes/page-2

I have mastered most of the old profiles from the works.
Because not a single camshaft specialist was able to provide what I wanted in the 1980s, I was advised to go and see HOLBAY, and Leonard Reece.
(The inventor of the REECE-FISH carb).

At the same time I was selling some bits and pieces to another "oldy" Mr Kilburn in Clamart France, who used to prepare, build and dyno run Matra V12 F1 engines. He also advised about all sorts of ways to do things, as we're all crazy about 6 cylinder and double six race engines.

There were quite a lot of people around you could learn from in the 80s.

Now?......?
Good luck to find anyone who knows anything.

Mike Randall used to make my exhausts.
He was making the Cosworth DFV exhausts for all the time they were winning.

It was still a small world in the 1980s, and lots of the old "Le Mans crap" was thrown out by the Triumph factory in Canley, as well as scrapping the entire Dolomite production line.
I saved quite a lot of stuff from going to scrap inc the race cams & some stuff from SAH.

None of these companies exists today.
Reece was the official camshaft grinder for COSWORTH.

I had Reece grind me some original COS cams for Ford engines, rather than buy copies from Kent. It makes a difference.

One of my (completely legal) Caterham challenge engines with a REECE cam made 123bhp on the dyno, instead of the Kent cam version which the book quoted as 110bhp max.
All the Kent cam versions I tested on my dyno made only about 99-104bhp in fact.
Have you seen the difference in a one marque challenge race when ONE engine makes 15-20% more power than the others?
I let you guess.

Holbay had their own Lotus L1 (twin cam) camshaft which outperfomed any of the copies.
You would be suprised to see what a few degrees of duration and a little lift change can make to a camshaft profile.

I went to Holbay, and got on great with John Read, so we developed a load of funny stuff up there, as well as mastering and grinding cams, inc all the works cams.
He wanted to buy (Cosworth) piston forgings from me, but in the end it never worked out.

I used to sell the SAH357 camshaft profile for Spitfire from the Kipping shop.
(This was a 6 cylinder GT6/TR6 profile, which ran very badly until 4000rpm where it went crazy,-thanks to the poor exhaust designs of SAH).

It went so much better in the GT6 engine after I fitted my exhaust, the first customer put the car on its roof in a hedge.

Everyone who had this camshaft (with SU carbs)on Spitfires said it went fantastic.
One of them is still running and goes really great 30 years on (!).
The car has been driven like mad ever since it was modified in the 80s.

The 357 camshaft has a little more lift than the TR5 type camshaft with 287 degrees duration.
I suspect it was originally developed at PIPER.
That would be my recommendation for the TR4.

I used to have this camshaft ground at Holbay on their Repco machine, which was imported from Australia because John had very strong connections with Repco, Fittipaldi, Pescarolo, and many of the 60s famous racing drivers.

At the same time I had the Holbay Lotus 7 S3 (R120) camshaft ground by Holbay.(it was a Ford Mexico world rally cam).
Lotus had a number of their cars fitted with the Holbay kit from the factory.

R120 was I believe developed on the dyno by John READ, but others were done by the other 4 dyno operators inc P Dunnell who still makes fantastic race engines today. (John was Paul's uncle!)
A copy got sold to Bastuck, who sells it to everyone and their dog today.
That is a decision I very much regret.

Fortunately I never made the mistake more than once with Bastuck, so all the other profiles I have, are available from no-one else.

You can complain I don't have a web shop, or a big retail outfit.
That is a decision I made when I left both Kipping & Cargraphic.
I don't want to be involved at that end of the market, I only deal "trade".

I'm not sure if you realise how camshafts were developed in the days of the slide rule and maths using "splines".
A successful camshaft design was developed in an engine on the dyno, by trying a given design, then adding a bit more lift or lobe acceleration here or there, until the power or torque showed an improvement.

Each time you ground another cam and tried it.

Slowly you would improve it more and more until you couldn't get it to make any more torque.
This of course if a very very long way to develop anything but it means you have a camshaft that is 100% proven to work & manually ground on a blank to give the perfect base circle.
That is the way all those 60s designs were done.

Modern camshafts are done almost entirely by computer simulation & algorithm, then ground by CNC.

I don't believe in the computer program bit, especially when no computer effort whatsoever is ever been done at Piper or Kent to adapt a given FORD cam design to the Triumph engine.

CNC enables you to make 100 copies in the same time as it takes to make 6 on a manual grinder, so you make a profit, but it guarantees 100% failure or replication of poor results, if the camshaft has never been tested or developed on Triumph engine on a dyno.

All the camshafts I have ever any hand in, were developed and tested before release on dynos.
If the dyno torque is not great at a particular revs, you can't hide it.

Fortunately I have some Triumph friends who test things for me & send me the torque curves when I can't do it myself.

Very often I suspect cams like Newman are done merely by guesswork, and some of the grinds I have seen from there, supposedly "WORKS" profiles don't even resemble the original camshaft.

eg:-
The Newman 300 degree camshaft 40-80 is in fact EXACTLY the same camshaft as back in 1980-85 with exactly the same poor slow speed response.

FYI:-
The Holbay Repco machine was sold 2-3yrs ago with all the masters, (by the successors of Holbay who bought up some of the bankrupt stock toooling- a total bunch of a-holes).

I was originally going to buy it, as Bob the (Holbay) cam grinder was dying of cancer.
The owners nevertheless despite the human drama, DID NOT stick by their word to sell it to me, and sold it to a "hobbyist".
This is fairly typical of the kind of "two faced" people in the trade today.

I have ONE brand new cam left from the original "357" Holbay batch to make a master from as well as their fantastic "TURBO" camshaft.

I sold the LAST Holbay full race cam to a guy in Las Vegas USA.
That is the only one a copy can ever be made from.

As a final aside to the history, the Holbay F2 ABARTH cam shown in the photo is actually in my JAG race engine, so that's still my last bits from them I'm using.



I will make a new master of the SAH 357 and new grinds again at the end of February.

I don't make money out of grinding and selling camshafts.
The profit margin is very poor if you want to make quality camshafts, but the subject is fascinating, because "NOTHING IS QUITE WHAT IT SEEMS".

Hope you find it interesting even though it's in English.

VOILA.

[Z320]

@head_guy6:
.
.
Simple answer, please.

Rgds Robert

Dear Head Guy,

also for me, please.

Marco

[MadMarx]

To give a hind:

Brand: ?
Type: ?

[HarryConti]

The 357 camshaft has a little more lift than the TR5 type camshaft with 287 degrees duration.
I suspect it was originally developed at PIPER.
That would be my recommendation for the TR4.



I will make a new master of the SAH 357 and new grinds again at the end of February.


Hat er doch geschrieben!! Mein Englisch ist nicht perfekt aber das habe ich schon verstanden.